How about making the graphics all on the same scale, so that rolling down the list of schools lets you make a real comparison?

[QUOTE id="fe2bf78c-f073-49b6-9e10-3e6e1b290412"]I have faith only in Stetson. Furda is a poseur to the throne. One more year or I destroy him.[/QUOTE] Jon, I'll I have to say is...."Nithe! Nithe..."

Are you kidding?: "Brown isn't even a real school". Trash talk only works when you can actually get into a real ivy. 10.8% acceptance rate for Brown '13 -- there is nothing more to say. So glad that I don't need the ridiculous Penn safety net anymore! Penn's truly proven itself irrelevant. Run along and play with your clone Cornell. And while you're at it, do us all a favor -- leave the Ivy League. Stop disgracing yourselves. Jeez, we need to get some real ivy-material schools in here to keep the property values up.....Stanford? Duke? Wanna take their place?

[QUOTE id="70686bdd-089a-40fb-bdd2-ea300a644e35"]Are you kidding?: "Brown isn't even a real school". Trash talk only works when you can actually get into a real ivy. 10.8% acceptance rate for Brown '13 -- there is nothing more to say. [/QUOTE] Only for those with very little worth saying. There is no doubt that the allure of not having to take classes outside of one's comfort zone (no curriculum--sorry, "Open Curriculum"), and not having to be graded in classes that aren't nice is appealing to many. However, for that, Brown simply isn't a real school. The idea that you can go through your entire college career without taking a course in quantitative studies or arts & letters is an appalling tribute to the excesses and excretions of the Baby Boomers. Brown's faculty are probably the least accomplished and impressive in the Ivy League. Enjoy your basket-weaving. I'll see you in a few years, when you're working for me.

Brown '13- congratulations on your acceptance- it is a great accomplishment. There is no reason to insult other universities. John's comments are also unfortunate. However, if one were to try to assess undergraduate academics across universities, the 2009 U.S. News rankings could be helpful. 1 Harvard University Cambridge, MA Score 100 Tier 1 2 Princeton University Princeton, NJ Score 99 Tier 1 3 Yale University New Haven, CT Score 98 Tier 1 4 Massachusetts Institute of Technology Cambridge, MA Score 94 Tier 1 4 Stanford University Stanford, CA Score 94 Tier 1 6 California Institute of Technology Pasadena, CA Score 93 Tier 1 6 University of Pennsylvania Philadelphia, PA Score 93 Tier 1 8 Columbia University New York, NY Score 90 Tier 1 8 Duke University Durham, NC Score 90 Tier 1 8 University of Chicago Chicago, IL Score 90 Tier 1 11 Dartmouth College Hanover, NH Score 89 Tier 1 12 Northwestern University Evanston, IL Score 87 Tier 1 12 Washington University in St. Louis St. Louis, MO 14 Cornell University Ithaca, NY Score 86 Tier 1 15 Johns Hopkins University Baltimore, MD Score 85 Tier 1 16 Brown University Providence, RI Score 84 Tier 1 17 Rice University Houston, TX Score 80 Tier 1 18 Emory University Atlanta, GA Score 79 Tier 1 18 University of Notre Dame Notre Dame, IN Score 79 Tier 1 18 Vanderbilt University Nashville, TN Score 79 Tier 1

Furda has nothing to do with this. How many people attended the school because of Stetson? Ultimately high caliber students will apply because of Penn's reputation. It has to do with school rankings, how visible alums are, and how the school is perceived by high schoolers who want to go someplace enjoyable. Furda has little or no control over the school's rankings, the success of alums, or the events the school puts on for undergrads, or the courses, degrees, and professors the school offers. Not to mention the security of students. If you want to point blame you are going to have to point at Gutman.

I want Rodin back! She did more for Penn than anyone else. Just look at the numbers 1994-2004, Penn rose from 16th to 4th in the U.S. News rankings.

1) The fact that a pre-frosh Brownie (Brown '13) is posting trash on Penn's newspaper website is... hilarious. Wait until you actually go to school to partake in ivy rivalry. If you really want to talk numbers, look at Penn's rank compared to Brown's on US News. Not that I take the ranking seriously, but I'm just showing what happens when we bring ourselves down to your level. 2) This is a transition year. Wait until next year before judging the new admissions dean. If he can't improve for '14ers, then we've got a problem. For now, I'm perfectly content that Penn denies 83% of the people who apply. Call me crazy.

I would like to see rates from regular decision ONLY. How could the writer not have calculated this given the data from early decision, because clearly this number includes the 30% early acceptance rate. I bet the regular rate falls somewhere around 14%, and even lower for Wharton and the College. Let's get some more numbers out here.

[QUOTE id="c060bea0-f369-4118-acc2-63a38cb4bc17"]1) The fact that a pre-frosh Brownie (Brown '13) is posting trash on Penn's newspaper website is... hilarious. Wait until you actually go to school to partake in ivy rivalry. If you really want to talk numbers, look at Penn's rank compared to Brown's on US News. Not that I take the ranking seriously, but I'm just showing what happens when we bring ourselves down to your level. 2) This is a transition year. Wait until next year before judging the new admissions dean. If he can't improve for '14ers, then we've got a problem. For now, I'm perfectly content that Penn denies 83% of the people who apply. Call me crazy.[/QUOTE] There is plenty to judge the new admissions dean on right now. Is anyone wondering why he is even at Penn? And, why was he forced out of admissions at Columbia? Some sort of unethical behavior perhaps? And, just as importantly, Columbia had no problem cutting him loose when he decided to move to Penn - in fact...told him not to stay .. just leave - six months before he was to start at Penn. As for how he is doing for Penn...let's see what happens over the next week or so and if he can actually yield the students he admitted. I don't think we have to wait until next year.

Rather than belabor the "catastrophic" increase in the undergrad admission rate, it may be more prudent to examine the impending yield rate. Although some may disdain early decision applicants for supposedly having weaker qualifications, at least they are more likely to be sincere in their desire to attend Penn instead of blindly chasing the Ivy League label. Hopefully the Class of 2013 won't be filled with embittered rejects from other schools. Getting in may no longer be the only tough part...paying for college is a growing concern. The yield rate in 1998 (my incoming class) was around 50% and the average cost attending was $35,000. I had met other high schoolers who, even though they were accepted to elite schools such as Dartmouth and Stanford, ultimately remained in-state for college because of familial financial restrictions. Even with financial aid, they decided that the cost burden was too high. Most of them entered 6-year honors programs wherein they got BA/MD, BA/JD, or BA/DMD at relatively low costs. If Penn wants to gain bragging rights for large numbers of naive Kamikaze applicants, it needs, among other actions, to improve its portrayal as an affordable institution. Harvard keeps on advertising its "70%" awarding rate of financial aid (although sociological studies have shown that the Ivy League remains populated primarily by wealthy/influential students). Effective propaganda, along with its reputation, has enabled that school to attract 29,000 applications, even though 27,000 ultimately were destined for the rejection pile.

If Furda can't do better next year then he is clearly not up to the job. This is sad when Brown (Brown!!) is doing better than we are.

Actually, I sense a greater marketing scheme here. By accepting more students from the south, midwest, and California, Furda is increasing Penn's visibility, and helping precipitate an increase in applications for next year. Let's face it: the Northeast is a saturated market. Furda knows what he's doing. Ye Must Have FAITH!

I have faith only in Stetson. Furda is a poseur to the throne. One more year or I destroy him.

Disgraceful. Brown isn't even a real school

This data is wrong. In fact all the data coming from admissions this year is inaccurate. Furda and his two associates are a disgrace to the standards set by Penn and Stetson. Let's just hope someone wises up soon.

These data could be presented more clearly if that the scale on the Y axis didn't change. That makes it easier to compare both across time *and* across school.

I guess this means I got a lousier education than I thought.

So the rumors are true. Penn people are pricks. Brown isn't even a real school? Since you're all so brilliant, I'm sure you realize that a school could get a million four year olds to apply, reject all of them, and have the lowest acceptance rate in the world. Then you'd really be better than everybody else!

17%? Wow. How did we go up and Cornell dropped a couple points to 19%? What are they doing differently? Penn used to have a really high admit rate, so maybe they're going back to that structure?

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